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The church is not an organization but an organism, a body — the Body of Christ (Eph. 1:22-23; Col. 1:18). As such, the church has the divine life. Although the church has the divine life, the life of the church must be healthy. For example, it is not enough for our physical body to simply have life. Many people have life in their body, but their body has lost its health and is sick. In addition to having life in our body, we need the life in our body to be healthy. Our physical body is a picture of the church, the Body of Christ. The way for the life of the church to be healthy is for the church to be filled with the experience of Christ as life. Without the experience of the life of Christ, the church has no health or reality. The reality of the church is the life of Christ; the life of the church is Christ as life (Col. 3:4).
We can never overstress the fact that the reality of the church is Christ Himself as life to every member of the Body. However, if we study the situation of Christianity, we will find that although this truth is so critical, it has been almost entirely ignored. I have studied church history and have read a number of biographies of believers from the past centuries. In addition, I was born among Christians and was brought up and educated in Christianity. I have learned much concerning the Scriptures from other Christians, and I have visited Christians in China and in many countries outside of China. Through all of this I have discovered that it is very difficult to find anyone ministering on the matter of Christ being life to us. In many places you will find groups of Christians who meet on the Lord’s Day, and among these Christians there will be some who minister the Word and give messages. However, although one may be able to hear many messages, it would be very difficult to find one message on the subject of Christ as life. There would likely be a great amount of teaching, doctrine, and knowledge but very little concerning knowing Christ as life in a practical way.
If you visit the churches in the fundamentalist movement, you will discover that they are for the most part fundamental in knowledge but not in life. If they were fundamental in life, they would be more living. With life there is always an impact. This is true with all forms of life. The Lord said in John 12:24 that when a grain of wheat falls into the ground and dies, it grows up and bears much fruit. Fruit-bearing is the impact of life. However, if you visit the fundamentalist churches in the United States, there is for the most part no fruit and no impact. From this we can conclude that these churches are fundamental in their teachings but not in the experience of life.
Many dear believers in the United States have the Scofield Reference Bible in their hands. I am not against the use of this Bible. In fact, when I was young I took a correspondence course with the Moody Bible Institute that used the Scofield Reference Bible, and I received much help from it. This Bible has greatly helped some to know the Scriptures. However, for most of them this knowledge has not resulted in the real experience of Christ in their daily life. They have used this Bible to acquire knowledge with their minds, but they have remained on the line of knowledge. As a result, most of the believers in this country are very weak.
Whereas the believers in the fundamental churches are focused on knowledge, those in the Pentecostal movement are preoccupied with something other than knowledge. They are focused on power and release, but these things are not life. Thus, their experience of life is also very limited. Their mistake is that they confuse power with life.
We should never neglect the history of Christianity, because this history contains the facts. We need to study this history and observe the present situation in an objective way. We should not be too subjective in studying and observing the present situation. If we visit the Assemblies of God or other branches of the Pentecostal movement, we will realize that although they have much release, they have very little life. They have much power but very little reality of Christ as life. We need to face this fact.
The proper government of the church is the outworking of the inner life within the believers. However, since there is a lack of life among the Lord’s children, it is very difficult for the proper government in the church to exist. Without life, the government of the church becomes a matter of organization. The human body is a composition of bones and tissue, and a table is a composition of a variety of parts. The difference between these two is that the human body has life and a table does not. Since a table has no life, it is a composition based solely on organization. However, since the human body has life, the bones and tissues in the body form not an organization but an organism, a composition of life. If the church does not have enough life, the government of the church will become solely a matter of organization. Someone may be able to set up a very good system for governing the church, and this system may even seem to be very scriptural. However, if the church does not have the adequate amount of life, this system will still be only an organization. A living body and a corpse are the same in terms of their parts; both have ears, a nose, bones, and legs. The difference between them is that a living body has life and a corpse does not. The proper government of the church is not a government based on organization but a government based on life.
Some may think that the government of the church is primarily a matter of power. This is not the case. Genuine church government depends eighty percent on life and only twenty percent on power. We can liken this to the government within a family. Every family must have some form of government. If a family has no government, that family will be a mess. The first thing needed for the government of a family is that the family members have life and that their life be proper and healthy. If all the members of a family were insane, they would not be able to have a proper family government. This would also be true if all the members of a family were underage. If both the children and the parents lacked the maturity in life, it would be impossible for them to have a proper family government. This demonstrates that life, that is, a proper and healthy life, is the primary necessity for government.
Once we have life, we need some power for the proper governing of the church. In order to govern, we need governing power, governing knowledge, and serving ability. I have observed that in some families in the West, the parents serve the food to their children during their meals. If you can serve well, you will be able to govern well. Without serving, you cannot rule. If you are to govern a church, you must serve it well. In fact, the only way to govern is by serving (Matt. 20:25-28). If you do not serve the saints, you will not be able to govern them well.
Thus, with both a family and the church, a sound government depends eighty percent on life and twenty percent on governing power, governing knowledge, and serving ability. If there are some in a local church who have the maturity in life, that church will have a good government. If all the members of a family are healthy and proper in terms of life, that family will have a proper government. In addition to having life, the family also needs a little governing power and serving ability. If a family or a local church has both life and power, the government of that family or church will be wonderful.
For a proper government to be established in a local church, the primary need of the saints in that locality is life. Thus, when we were in China and were visiting a locality, the first matter we dealt with was the matter of life. In many places we did not touch the matter of church government for as long as two to three years because the saints in those places were spiritually too young. Because they were childish, it was not possible for us to set up a government among them. If we try to set up a government among the saints when they are too young, all we will be able to do is to organize them. However, if we allow the saints to mature in life, after they have matured to a certain extent, they will develop into an organism. We will need to do only a small amount of appointing and arranging, and a government will arise among them out from their growth in life. Then we will be able to help them realize the governing power and the serving ability. The result will be a very proper government established in that local church. Thus, if we desire to have a sound government in a strong local church, we should stress the matter of the growth in life.
The New Testament confirms that the government of the church depends upon the growth in life. In the book of Acts very little is mentioned concerning church government because Acts deals only with the beginning of the church, when the saints were still young in the growth in life. In the Epistles from Romans to Revelation much more is mentioned concerning the government of the church. If we read these twenty-two books carefully, we will see that the government of the church is the outworking of the growth in life. For example, in Romans 8 Paul speaks concerning life. Those who experience this chapter have begun to mature in life and be conformed to the image of the firstborn Son of God (v. 29). Thus, after a parenthetical word in Romans 9 through 11, Paul begins to speak concerning the Body of Christ and the government of the church in Romans 12 through 16. In 1 Corinthians Paul deals with this matter further, revealing that there was something wrong with the government of the church in Corinth and indicating that this was due to a shortage of life (3:1-4). This is why in the first two chapters of this book the apostle tells the church in Corinth that they need the real experience of Christ as power and as wisdom (1:24). In these two chapters power refers to the power of life. The crucified and resurrected Christ as life is the power of the resurrection life and is wisdom to us. If we desire to have a strong local church with a sound government, we must experience the crucified and resurrected Christ. This is why Paul told the Corinthians that he had determined not to know anything but Christ and Him crucified (2:2). The Corinthians had power and gifts, but they did not have the proper government or a proper church, because they lacked the experience of Christ.
The government of the church always goes together with the divine life. Apart from the divine life and the growth in this life, all we have is organization. We need life, and we need growth. Consider the example of the human body. When a child is only two months old, the members of his body are not sufficiently developed to function. Even when a child is two years old, his members are still not fully able to function. We cannot send a baby to school to attend the first grade. A baby can see and hear, but he is not mature enough to attend first grade. He must first grow and mature. If we could cause a baby to instantly become five years old, twenty-one years old, or fifty years old, it would be a miracle, but there are no such miracles related to the matter of life. In order to become twenty-one years old, a person must live for twenty-one years. For twenty-one years he must eat three meals a day and get a sufficient amount of sleep every night. With regard to life, there are no miracles; there are only principles. Not even modern science can cause people to mature more quickly. Since I have experienced and witnessed miracles, I believe in miracles. However, when it comes to the matter of life, there are no miracles. Time is required for the saints to grow in life. Thus, we need to help the Lord’s children live, grow, and go on in a gradual way.
When it comes to the government of the church, nothing is more important than the growth in life. If the saints in a locality have the adequate growth in life, it will be easy for them to have the proper church government. If there is the growth in life among us, then spontaneously some brothers will begin to function in a certain way, and all the rest of the saints will recognize that these brothers are the elders. This is the way that a family governs itself. If all the members of a family gradually grow in life and are healthy, that family will spontaneously have a family government. Recently, I observed the behavior of the children of a brother in whose home I was staying. I noticed that the oldest child took care of the younger children. When I saw him doing this, I knew that he was the oldest child. He was the “elder” among the children in that family. There was no need for the children to come together and vote to determine who was the elder among them. All the younger children automatically recognized that the oldest child was the elder among them. It was quite clear to them. It is the growth in life that makes this clear.
This principle applies to the deacons as well as to the elders in the church. Based upon their growth in life, some of the brothers and sisters will automatically rise up to serve the saints. Out of their love for the Lord, the church, and the saints, they will simply begin to serve. The Greek word for deacon means “a serving one.” Thus, those who spontaneously begin to serve others based upon their growth in life are the real serving ones, the real deacons. When they begin to serve in this way, others will recognize that they are the deacons.
This principle also applies to all the ministries in the church. Perhaps one member of a family develops into a good cook, and another member of the family develops into a good sewer. Since these are their gifts, they will spontaneously take care of the cooking and the sewing in the family. This is also the case with the different ministries in the church. There is very little need for spending human effort to make arrangements. This is not to say that there is absolutely no need for any arranging but rather that this need is small. Similar to what takes place in a family, there is the need for only a small amount of arranging based upon what has already been expressed through the growth in life. We can do a little arranging based upon what has already been spontaneously expressed, but everything must be the outworking of the growth in life.
The Lord’s way is the way of life and the growth in life. Thus, if we take this way, the Lord will honor it. This is truly wonderful, for when the Lord honors something, He blesses it. If, however, we take our own way, we will lose the Lord’s presence, and there will be no blessing. When the Lord does not honor the way that we take, we are forced to do everything with our own human effort. Christianity has complicated the matter of the government of the church. In the denominations the government of the church is based almost entirely on organization. However, if we follow the Lord’s way revealed in the Bible — the way of life — everything will be very simple, and we will receive the Lord’s blessing.
A proper church must not only take the way of life; it must also be inclusive. We must be inclusive of and open to all the Lord’s children, and we must be inclusive of all spiritual matters. In particular, there are at least five items of which we must be inclusive — life, the truth, the church, the gospel, and power. In every local church we must have the line of the inner life, the line of the truth, the line of the church life, the line of the preaching of the gospel, which includes the preaching of the gospel in foreign countries, and the line of power, which includes the outpouring of the Holy Spirit and all the gifts of the Holy Spirit. A local church must be inclusive of these five lines. We should not say, “We are evangelical,” or “We are solely taking the line of the church.” Every local church must have a balanced diet. If we are not inclusive of these five lines, we will automatically become sectarian. I cannot agree with the fundamentalists who are against the Pentecostal movement. This is wrong. We must be inclusive of even the Pentecostal movement. Some other groups are opposed to the teachings of the Brethren, considering their teachings to be merely dead teachings. This is also sectarian and extreme. Although the Brethren may be lacking in life, many of their teachings are very sound. Thus, we must learn the truths that they teach. This does not mean that we should receive everything; we need to discern what is right and what is wrong. Nevertheless, we must be inclusive. If we are inclusive, the Lord will be with us. If we are exclusive, we will lose certain aspects of the Lord’s blessing. We must receive, take, and be inclusive of everything that is scriptural and spiritual.
If someone comes among us and begins to speak in tongues, we must welcome him. If someone presents a certain truth from a passage of the Scriptures, we should receive him as well. This is the Lord’s way. The Lord is deep and great, and what He gives to His Body is inclusive. Over the past two thousand years the Lord has given many things to His Body, and we must receive them all. However, we must not follow any one item to the exclusion of the others. We should receive every item, but we should not follow any one item in a particular way.
In the Far East, friends would often come to visit us. While they were with us, they would see many new things. After being with us for one day, they would say, “You people are very much like those in the Pentecostal movement.” After being with us for a few more weeks, they would change their mind and say, “You people are very much like the Brethren.” Then after attending another meeting, they would tell us, “Today you are just like the Methodists.” After another month they might see a baptism among us, and then they would say, “Actually, you are just like the Baptists.” In fact, all these observations are correct. This is why this part of the Lord’s work in China has been so blessed by the Lord. It has been blessed because it is not closed to any of the Lord’s children or to anything good that is from the Lord. We receive everything that is of the Lord. We have even received some things from the Catholics and have translated a number of books that were written by Brother Lawrence and Father Fenelon. Because we have been inclusive in this way, the Lord has blessed us.
According to the Scriptures, we should stress only two matters — Christ and the church. If we are going to stress anything, we must stress Christ as life and everything to us and the church as the expression of Christ. These two items are all-inclusive; all the other items are contained within them. Many of us may have experienced some of the Pentecostal things, but we should never say that we are only Pentecostal. If we say this, we kill ourselves. The Pentecostal grace is only one of the many graces that the Lord has given and is still giving to His Body. Surely we must give heed to the experience of the baptism in the Holy Spirit, but we should not stress this too much. The experience of Pentecost is a minor point; it is not the central matter. The central matter is Christ and the church, that is, Christ with His Body. We agree with and appreciate all the good and scriptural things in Christianity, but if someone neglects Christ as life or opposes the church, we cannot stand with him. To neglect Christ as life or to oppose the church is to spoil the Lord’s eternal purpose. Everything is for Christ and the church, including justification, sanctification, and the baptism in the Holy Spirit. Thus, we must be inclusive, but if anyone opposes Christ or is against the church, we cannot agree with him.
If we are genuinely inclusive of all the Lord’s children and of all the good things that are of the Lord, we will be blessed by the Lord. On the one hand, we will be a reservoir to contain the Lord’s blessing, and on the other hand, we will be a stream to flow out the Lord’s blessing. Thus, let us all endeavor to be inclusive.
If we consider the history of the church over the past four to five hundred years, we will see that during this time the Lord has recovered many things. The Lord’s recovery began with the recovery of the truth of justification by faith. This truth was recovered through Martin Luther at the time of the Reformation. Following the Reformation, many other truths were recovered, including sanctification by faith, holiness by faith, the living of a life by faith, victory by faith, and many other items.
In the 1700s some of the dear saints who were in the Lord’s recovery began to pay attention to the church life. As a result, at that time in Europe there were many kinds of brethren meetings. In the eighteenth century some brothers moved to Bohemia to be with Count Zinzendorf. Under his leadership they began to practice the church life, and to some extent it was proper and even quite wonderful. At that time these saints experienced the baptism in the Holy Spirit, and this issued in a big revival. They enjoyed genuine brotherly love and truly practiced the church life. This was an all-inclusive expression of all the items that the Lord had recovered from Luther’s time up to that point. These brothers received all the positive things that had been recovered before them.
The practice of the church life by the brothers in Bohemia was good, but the Lord desired to do something more. Thus, approximately one hundred years later, at the beginning of the nineteenth century, the Lord raised up some brothers in England under the leadership of John Nelson Darby. Their practice of the church life was even better than that of the brothers in Moravia. These brothers in England were very inclusive of all the positive things that the Lord had recovered before them. Unfortunately, they excluded anything further that the Lord tried to recover. They took in all the good things that had been recovered from the Reformation until 1828, but once they had received all those things, they felt satisfied and felt that what they had achieved was good enough. They did not realize that the Lord still had much more that He wanted to recover. As a result, they became exclusive and would not receive the things that the Lord recovered after them.
After raising up the Brethren, the Lord continued to advance His recovery. The next major item that the Lord recovered was the inner life. For this the Lord used William Law and then Andrew Murray. Andrew Murray took all the good things that the mystics and William Law had recovered. Although Andrew Murray made great progress in the matter of the inner life, the Brethren excluded him and would not receive what he had recovered. Hannah Smith was also one whom the Lord used in recovering the matter of the inner life. She wrote the book The Christian’s Secret of a Happy Life and was also excluded by the Brethren.
Outside the Brethren movement the Lord made great progress in the matter of the inner life. He also made improvements in the preaching of the gospel. Charles Spurgeon of England and D. L. Moody of America were both evangelical giants in the nineteenth century, but neither of them were in the Brethren movement. In fact, many of the missionaries who were sent to the mission fields and who spread the gospel over the whole earth were not part of the Brethren movement. Both the recovery of the inner life and the recovery of the preaching of the gospel were reactions to the Brethren movement.
A third reaction to the Brethren movement was the Pentecostal movement. The Lord raised up the Pentecostal movement because the Brethren focused excessively on knowledge. The Brethren practiced the church life, but they were too much on the line of knowledge. Thus, the Lord responded by recovering the line of the inner life, the preaching of the gospel, and the power of Pentecost.
In the present age the Lord desires to build up the church life and to bring in a new era of the church life. He is seeking after a people who will receive all the good things that have been recovered in the past and who are also open to the new things that He will do in the future. By the Lord’s mercy and grace we have been practicing to take this way through the ministry of Watchman Nee for more than thirty-five years. This is why the Lord has blessed the work in China so much. When the Western missionaries came to China, we said to them, “Brothers and sisters, there is no need for you to come to China to build up different churches. Instead, you must join us and together we will build up the Lord’s church in China. You do not need to come here to build up the Methodist church or the Presbyterian church; simply join with us.” Although we spoke to them in this way, very few of them agreed with us. Nearly all of them wanted to keep their own “churches.” As a result, they and their work received little blessing from the Lord. On the other hand, the work in China under the ministry of Watchman Nee has been prevailing. The reason it has been prevailing is that it is something according to the Lord’s heart and the Lord’s desire.
I believe that the Lord now wants to raise up something in the United States. Thus, if we are faithful to Him and take a stand to be inclusive of the past and open to the future, we will become a great reservoir to contain the Lord’s blessing and a strong stream to flow the Lord’s blessing to all the other countries throughout the whole earth. All that I have mentioned above is the history of the Lord’s recovery, and we must learn from this history.
Question: What is the best place in which to hold the meetings of the church? Are the homes the best place?
Answer: From the Scriptures and from our experience, we have seen that there are two places in which we should have the meetings. The first place is in the homes. Without home meetings the saints will never have the opportunity to fellowship together in a thorough way. In addition to the homes, there is the need for a location where all the saints can come together to meet. This location can be either large or small. The book of Acts tells us that at times the saints in Jerusalem were separated into different meetings in their homes and that at other times all the saints assembled together (2:46; 12:12; 20:7-8).
Question: How often should the assembling of the whole church together take place?
Answer: This depends on the situation and the need. The whole church may assemble together weekly, bi-weekly, or monthly. At a minimum, all the saints should come together quarterly. The Scriptures reveal that the whole church should come together (1 Cor. 14:23, 26). There is definitely a need for this. In the church in Taipei this is our practice. At present we have thirty-seven district meetings in the church in Taipei during the week. On the Lord’s Day the saints meet in nine different halls throughout the city. Then from time to time all the saints in Taipei will come together for a specific purpose — either to have some particular fellowship, to hear a message, or for a conference. Sometimes the whole church comes together to have the Lord’s table. Most of the time we have the Lord’s table in the homes, less often we have the Lord’s table in the nine halls, and periodically we have the Lord’s table all together in one place. Sometimes several thousand attend this meeting.
Question: If there are thirty-seven district meetings, how do all of the saints know where they are supposed to meet?
Answer: All the saints know where they should go to meet because there is some church government. After a new convert has been baptized, the church assigns him to a certain district. This assignment is based upon where this new convert lives, so that it is convenient for him to attend the meetings and for the church to take care of him. Once the saints in the church grow in life and the church government is arranged in a proper way, the handling of these kinds of practical matters becomes very easy. The only problem that we have in the church in Taipei is that we have too many new converts. We are like a family that has too many children and no one to take care of all of them. As a result, the brothers and sisters are hesitant to preach the gospel because they already have so many children. Those who are saved into the church respect the government of the church very much.
Question: Do you think that those who are saved respect the government of the church as a result of the way that people are raised in the East? People in the West are very independent. They do not like to be told what to do.
Answer: I do not think that this is the reason. In fact, I believe that the people in the West will respect the government of the church more than those in the East. The most important thing is that there is a proper government in the church. When there is a proper government, there will be the presence of the Lord, and everyone will respect the presence of the Lord.
When a proper government is raised up in a local church, the Lord honors it. Then if someone decides to rebel against the government of the church, the Lord’s hand will come in. The Lord will take action in a clear way and deal with the situation. When some rebelled against Moses in the Old Testament, the Lord came in to vindicate Moses’ authority (Num. 12:1-15; 16:1—17:13). Today those who rebel against God’s government will face a similar fate in that they will become spiritually dead.
Question: I am from a Presbyterian background. In the Presbyterian denomination all the pastors are hired. How do you find someone to preach the messages if you do not hire someone?
Answer: First, a proper church is like a home, a family. We all know how dear our home is to us. Second, a proper church is like a school, where we can learn many things. The church takes care of our spiritual education. Third, a proper church is like a factory, where we learn to work and manufacture and can practice what we have been taught. Fourth, a proper church is like a field, where we learn how to farm. Fifth, the church is like a battlefield; we learn to fight the battle in the church. Sixth, a proper church is like a hospital, a place where all those who are sick can receive care. Thus, the church is all-inclusive. In such an all-inclusive environment, the members who are gifted will gradually be manifested and will begin to minister. After having been saved and having sought the Lord in a definite way in the church for eight to ten years, some will be manifested as having a ministry.
Question: Since it takes eight to ten years for a minister to be raised up, do you recommend that the church have an apostle or missionary during this time to care for the church?
Answer: This depends on the situation. In some places there may be the need for an apostle to stay for a period of time. In other places there may not be such a need.
Question: Would you say that it is necessary to have as a nucleus a few who see the proper way of the church?
Answer: Yes, this is necessary. We know that with anything, a good beginning is needed. If there is a good beginning, there can be a good continuation. In order for a local church to have a good beginning, there is a need for a nucleus of saints to stay in a certain place to lay a foundation. Once a foundation is laid, others will be able to follow more easily. We can see this in modern production processes. The most difficult matter in the manufacturing process is getting it started. However, once you have a factory in place and have begun production, it is easy to continue. Later, improvements can be made, but the key is to have a good beginning. As long as you have a good beginning, things will proceed automatically.
In the church life it is easy for some to be trained both practically and in life to become ministers for the Lord. When a new one comes into a proper church that has a proper government, after eight or so years this one, if he has a ministry, will be manifested as a minister. This is the right way to produce gifted ones. The right way to produce gifted ones is not through Bible institutes or seminaries; the right way is through the church. This is another reason why the church must be inclusive. The church must be inclusive so that all the new believers may be educated in many things. Those who come into the church in the Far East learn a great deal of the truth because we have many different studies in the church. Sometimes we study a book of the Bible, sometimes we study a particular topic, and at other times we study a special line of truth. In this way the new believers are able to receive a good spiritual education.
Question: Is the baptism in the Spirit an experience that a believer should particularly seek at the beginning of his Christian life, or is it something that a believer will experience without seeking?
Answer: The baptism in the Spirit is not an experience that is only for new believers. This experience is for all believers and is for our entire Christian life. We need to continually experience the baptism in the Holy Spirit.
The baptism in the Spirit is not a life matter but a matter related to power. This is seen very clearly in the life of the Lord Jesus. When the Lord was thirty years old, He came forth to serve the Lord, but before He began His service, He was baptized in water. Immediately following this baptism, the Holy Spirit descended upon Him like a dove (Matt. 3:16). This was the Lord’s experience of the baptism in the Holy Spirit. For the first thirty years of His life before He received the baptism in the Holy Spirit, the Lord was surely living with God and before God. He was definitely One who was full of the divine life. We cannot say that prior to receiving the baptism in the Spirit, the Lord did not have the fullness of the divine life. The Lord surely had the divine life, but for His service He needed the Spirit to descend upon Him. This is a matter of power. Regrettably, many Christians today confuse these matters, thinking that the baptism in the Spirit is something related to life. Thus, they misunderstand this matter and misuse it.
