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Some saints are not clear concerning matters such as Christ’s being in us and Christ’s being in the church; therefore, we would like to have some fellowship focusing on their questions.
Question: How can such a rich Christ become the reality in the church and in the individual believers? How can He be formed in us quickly?
Answer: If a person is walking on the right path while pursuing the Lord, sooner or later he will see that throughout the ages God’s work in His plan is primarily to work Christ into man, whether in creation or redemption. We should not say that no one has seen this matter in the last two thousand years, but we can say that very few have seen this. Man’s natural concept and natural thought is his greatest problem before God. Christians must have the realization that man’s natural concept is a problem that hinders Christ from living in them.
We each have our natural concept and natural view. After salvation some saints think that it is good to never lose their temper, and others focus on the way of the church. There is nothing wrong with this. However, Christ can be hindered from living in one who regards the way of the church above everything else, because his firm belief in the way of the church may not be the result of revelation from God. Perhaps there is an affinity to the way of the church in his background, environment, and state of mind; thus, it is easy for him to comprehend and to accept the way of the church. Hence, his understanding and acceptance of the way of the church is something natural and human.
Everyone who is saved should have a heart for the Lord, but the fact is that many do not have such a heart. There is no need to speak concerning the following matter with one who does not have a heart for the Lord. The Lord desires man to live by Him and let Him live in man so that man may live out His riches. The Lord has no way in one who does not have a heart for Him. However, the Lord also has a problem with those who have a heart for Him; this problem is their natural concept. We either do not love the Lord, or once we love the Lord, we think that we should be zealous, humble, work diligently, preach the gospel for the Lord, fellowship with the brothers and sisters, and build up the church. Apparently, these are good concepts, but in those who love the Lord, these concepts are the biggest enemies of Christ and hinder Him the most. Therefore, strictly speaking, even our eager expectation to live out the riches of Christ can possibly be according to human concept and therefore be the biggest enemy of Christ.
Let us consider, can we actually live out Christ by our eagerness? Can we live out Christ merely because we want to do so? This is a human concept. I am afraid that with many of us, our eyes have not been opened to see that “wanting” to live out Christ is a human concept, a human work. Man’s “wanting” to live out Christ is actually an enemy of God. Whatever man “wants” to be and do originates from man himself, and this hinders Christ from being lived out.
There must be a day when God shows us that we have nothing, that we are good for nothing, and that we are devoid of any merit. Moreover, we must see that God’s intention is to work Christ into us. First, we need to see that all our concepts are useless. Regardless of how good our concepts are, they frustrate Christ from being lived out of us. Second, we need to see that God’s intention is to work Christ into us. This is a revelation and a vision. We need to ask God to have mercy on us that we may have such a vision. Merely listening to man’s preaching is futile. Once a person sees the vision, no matter who he is, he will prostrate himself before the Lord and stop all his speaking; he will no longer say that he will be good, zealous, humble, gentle, and diligent. We may be eager and try to study how to live out Christ, but we will be unable to make it in ourselves.
Question: What if we genuinely “want” to “let” Him live?
Answer: This is a mysterious matter. If one has a vision, “letting” works, but if one is without a vision, “letting” does not work. The shining upon Paul on the way to Damascus is a typical case (Acts 9:1-9). Before receiving the light, Paul was full of natural concepts in his service to God. He went to Damascus for the purpose of arresting Christians because he was exceedingly zealous for God. He did not have the thought, the intention, to sin or oppose God. On the contrary, he loved God and followed the footsteps of his forefathers to serve God in a pure conscience. However, after the shining of the light on the way to Damascus, his whole being was stopped, and he became blind. This means that he no longer had his own view and concept.
If we want to let Christ live in us, we must have a vision and a revelation. There must be a day when the Spirit of God shows us that the greatest hindrance to Christ’s being lived out of us is our self. Our concept represents our self. We need to see this in order for us to stop our entire being. This does not mean that we do not need to pursue the Lord and love Him. We must still have a heart for the Lord and pursue to go on with Him. But in our pursuit of Him we must stop ourselves. If we have the revelation of the Holy Spirit and truly stop our doing, allowing Him to work in us and to give us vision and revelation, we will see a strong twofold revelation. Such a revelation, on the one hand, will cause us to love the Lord even more fervently and, on the other hand, will cause us to stop our entire being, to stop our self.
We all love the Lord, we at least love Him a little, but we may have a bad temper. Hence, whenever we draw near to the Lord, we have the hope that our temper will be improved, and we therefore ask the Lord to help us. However, we need the Lord to open our eyes to see that even such a little hope is a natural concept that can be a hindrance to the Lord. We need to stop ourselves, but this is not an easy matter. When we see the light and receive revelation, we must stop ourselves; then we must give ourselves, consecrate ourselves, to Christ, not to do something for Him but to consent to His living in us. He cannot live in us before He has obtained our consent. We must agree with Him and give ourselves completely to Him.
We often have the thought of doing something for the Lord when consecrating ourselves to Him. When we give ourselves to the Lord, we frequently have a desire and make the decision to do something for Him. Very few consecrated ones do not have such a thought. In fact, nearly every consecrated one has an intention of doing something for the Lord. It is right for us to consecrate ourselves to the Lord, but we need to drop our desire to do something for Him. It is a natural concept, a human concept, to want to do something for the Lord, and it is this concept, this very thought, that frustrates Christ from being lived out of us. In our consecration we do not see that Christ is all and that He wants to live in us to be our all. Rather, we think that Christ needs our service and our work and that we are somewhat useful to Him. Such a thought becomes a hindrance to the carrying out of God’s eternal plan in us. Although we have a heart for the Lord, when we have such a thought, we do not let Him have all the room in us.
Therefore, we must see that we are a problem to Christ. If we hand ourselves over to Christ without bringing along our own terms, desires, and intentions, He will be able to do what He desires in us. When we hand ourselves over to Christ, we should not hope that He will help us control our temper and make us gentle, nor should we pray that He will help us become useful in His hand and enable us to do something for Him. We should merely give ourselves to Him to be of the same mind with Him and to walk with Him, not having our own hope, view, and purpose but simply allowing Him to live in us. We need strong light from the Lord to show us that the way to enter into God’s life depends upon our seeing these two points.
Question: What steps must we take before we can see these two points?
Answer: “It is not of him who wills, nor of him who runs, but of God who shows mercy” (Rom. 9:16). The eggs laid by a hen hatch and bring forth chickens because there is life in the eggs. If we have some imitation eggs that look exactly the same as real eggs, they will not hatch because they are void of life. Therefore, we can only say, “Be merciful to me, O God! Enable me to see that Your plan is for Your Son to be revealed in me, to be formed in me, and to fill my whole being so that He may live Himself out through me.” It is only by revelation that we can see this. We cannot see it by exercising our will, by running, by wishing, or by thinking; all these human efforts are enemies of Christ and hindrances to Him. We must stop ourselves. Today if Christians do not have a heart for the Lord, they will have no desire to do anything for Him. However, merely having a heart for the Lord is insufficient. A brother once asked, “Christ is rich, but why am I not rich inwardly?” It will not work, and it will be useless for him to strive every day for Christ’s riches to come into him.
Please bear in mind that while we should have a heart for the Lord, we should cease all our efforts. People always like to ask, “What shall we do?” Whether in the Gospels or in Acts, from the time the Lord Jesus preached the gospel of grace, these questions were frequently asked: “What shall I do? How shall I work?” Then in Romans 9:16 Paul says, “It is not of him who wills, nor of him who runs, but of God who shows mercy.” Romans 9 is the answer to all the questions. It is not a matter of “doing”; there is not such a thing as “doing.” “Though the children had not yet been born nor had done anything good or bad...it was said to her, ‘The greater shall serve the less’;...‘Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated’...‘I will have mercy on whomever I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whomever I will have compassion’” (vv. 11-15). After hearing this kind of word, if we can peacefully leave, saying, “Good! Let us all go home!” this may indicate that we have not been shown mercy. However, struggles may indicate that we have been shown a little mercy. Jacob struggled because he was shown mercy. But it was only when he stopped himself that mercy was fully manifested. However, when this one, who once held his brother’s heel as a supplanter and a deceitful man, ceased his doing, God’s mercy was manifested in him.
Perhaps not many can understand these words, but we believe that as long as these words remain in the church, one day they will shine upon some among us. We cannot comprehend these words in Christ by merely listening to a few messages. Jacob was shown God’s mercy. But this was not fully manifested until he was at Peniel. There he wrestled with God; it seemed that God could not subdue him, but in the end God caused him to be crippled. Jacob loved God, but did he calculate according to God’s calculation in the universe? He was so skillful that no one could prevail against him. He even struggled with God, but he was crippled when God touched the socket of his hip. From that day on God’s mercy was manifested in him (Gen. 32:22-32).
God wants to work Christ into man, but man must stop his doing. No one knows how long it will take for us to stop ourselves; perhaps it will not happen until we are thirty, forty, or fifty years old. However, we should never think that some people are soft toward God. The fact is that we are all very hardened toward God. It is not easy for us to stop ourselves after only half a year or even a year; we need to pass through quite a long time. This is our real situation; we need to know ourselves.
Question: Does our stopping need to pass through the experience in Romans 7:25 — “through Jesus Christ our Lord”?
Answer: We all know that when we preach the gospel, those who believe will be saved. However, if there are one thousand people listening to the gospel, not every one of them will have faith and be saved. Some gospel friends are still waiting, even after being repeatedly urged. This shows that even man’s believing is the work of the Holy Spirit. Although we are responsible for preaching the gospel and for speaking, the Holy Spirit can work what we have preached and spoken into people. For example, I may be preaching the gospel on the podium; some in the audience may have come for the first time and others may have come several times. I may repeatedly say, “You must believe! You must believe!” Some may believe immediately, and others may not believe regardless of how much I say, “You must believe.” Thus, whether a person believes is absolutely not dependent on our work.
Suppose we give a message that we must see the vision, consecrate ourselves, believe, and obey in order to let Christ live in us. After hearing this word, those who have been shown mercy will be enlightened, stop their entire being, and give themselves to Christ without reservation. This proves that the word entered into them. However, if a person has not been shown mercy, even if he can recite the points of the message about seeing a vision, consecrating himself, believing, and obeying, nothing will happen within him. Three or five years later the Holy Spirit may work in him, causing him to see the light. At that time he will clearly understand the message that he heard earlier, and then he will stop himself.
God’s mercy creates an opportunity for us to stop ourselves in the presence of Christ and to realize that our behavior, our actions, and our desire to live out Christ are enemies of Christ. Even our good behavior and our actions for Christ are enemies of Christ, not to mention our bad behavior. When God causes us to see this, we will stop our entire being; we will stop ourselves thoroughly. This is not the issue of man’s exhortation. We will not know the meaning of consecrating ourselves, giving ourselves to Christ, and letting Him live in us until a time of God’s predetermination. Then we will clearly see that the faith in which we believe in Christ is Christ Himself. “The life which I now live in the flesh I live in faith, the faith of the Son of God” (Gal. 2:20b).
Question: Is it possible to enter into the experience of Christ’s living in us immediately?
Answer: Some enter immediately, and others enter gradually. For example, with the experience of salvation some can say that they were saved on a specific date, but others, mainly those who grew up in Christian families, become clear regarding their salvation gradually. Andrew Murray is an example of one who gradually became clear of our need to stop ourselves. Andrew Murray, in his book The Spirit of Christ, repeatedly emphasizes that we must stop ourselves. Related to consecration, he does not say that we need to present something; rather, he uses the word surrender instead of consecration. This means that he was disarmed by Christ, defeated by Christ, and submitted himself to Christ.
This experience of Andrew Murray is correct. He mentions repeatedly our need to stop the activities of the flesh. When we truly have a vision of Christ, our entire being will be stopped, and we will see that Christ wants to live in us. Then we will no longer hope for patience and zeal. If we have seen that we can ride in a car, why would we want to ride a bicycle? Our entire being will be still when we see Christ; our zeal, patience, and humility will come to a halt, and we will completely surrender and submit ourselves to Him. We will say, “Lord, You are the Lord! You are the Lord of all, and all are Yours.”
Whereas some see this immediately after they are saved, others see this gradually, beginning at the time of their salvation until they reach a certain point where they are thoroughly clear. From the autobiography of Andrew Murray, we know that he did not experience a sudden change. Even though he feared the Lord from his youth, he did not know on which day he was saved. He could only say that he realized he was saved and regenerated when he was in school. In The Spirit of Christ he does not clearly indicate on what day he saw that Christ lived in him. However, because he definitely saw that Christ lived in him, he could write this book; moreover, he already had a great deal of experience when he wrote the book.
We need to pursue having a heart for the Lord, a heart that loves Him, yet we should realize our pursuing and running are useless. This may sound contradictory. If our pursuing is useless, should we stop pursuing? No, we must still pursue. On the one hand, we must pursue, but on the other hand, we need to realize that our pursuing avails nothing. We need to look to the Lord for His mercy that we might see. We should not believe that our zeal, diligence, or heart for the Lord are useful. These may help us work for Christ, but they cannot help us live out Christ. For us to live out Christ, our entire being must be stopped; even our being for Christ must be stopped. We must stop our entire being before Christ.
There are two sisters mentioned in John 11, Mary and Martha. In Christianity there is not an accurate understanding regarding these two sisters. Mary was not merely “quiet”; rather, she was one who stopped herself. Even though many people may be quiet, they cannot stop themselves. Martha was very active and also could not stop herself. Some sisters are very active; they are typical “Marthas.” Other sisters are very quiet; they are seemingly typical “Marys.” However, it is possible that both groups of sisters are “Marthas.” Those who are quiet outwardly may not be still inwardly. In the meetings many sisters bow their heads and pray silently, but their blood cells are racing at top speed. Outwardly they are quiet, yet inwardly they cannot stop. In contrast, other sisters outwardly are running diligently, but their inner being is at rest. Hence, neither quietness nor activeness determines whether a sister is a Mary or a Martha. It is not a matter of whether one is quiet or active but of whether one has stopped himself.
Although saints everywhere are eager to attend revival meetings, we like to hold “calm” meetings. Our concept is radically different. I would be very concerned if someone has been stirred up by these messages or is very excited as a result of these meetings. This is because these messages are not to excite people but to cause them to stop themselves completely.
For over two hundred years, since the time of John Wesley and Count Zinzendorf, the churches on the European continent have taken the way of revival. In these two hundred years many people have been raised up to do the work of revival. However, God also raised up a few who knew Him in a deep way. These ones repeatedly pointed out that the way of revival is not the best way for God to accomplish His purpose. The way of revival can bring people to salvation, but it cannot fulfill God’s plan for the church. The way of revival can cause the church to increase in number, but it cannot cause the Body of Christ to increase in stature. For many years we have been crying out to the saints who do the work of revival, saying, “We admit that your work has rendered Christians some help, but it cannot fulfill God’s plan.” Even though most saints care for revivals, we cannot do this work. Today the churches of the Lord do not need a work of revival but a work of revelation. We must let the Lord come in to show all who have a heart for Him what He wants to accomplish in His eternal plan.
When Paul wrote the book of Ephesians, he prayed that God would grant the saints a spirit of wisdom and revelation in the full knowledge of Him, in order that we might know what is the hope of His calling, what are the riches of the glory of His inheritance in the saints, what is the surpassing greatness of His power toward us who believe, and know the church as the Body of Christ, the fullness of the One who fills all in all (cf. 1:17-19, 23). Such knowledge cannot be obtained by being stirred up; it requires the revelation of the Holy Spirit. We can hold a three-day conference twice a year in which the saints continually shout Hallelujah. What happens after they have been “pumped up with air” in this way? We need to know that the faster air is pumped in, the faster it will leak out. After being “pumped up with air,” some local churches are unable to continue carrying on their meetings; the work of revival always issues in this kind of result.
In mainland China a great number of people were saved through the revival work of John Sung, who is a perfect example of a revivalist. When John Sung conducted meetings, people would come and shout, “The precious blood of Jesus washes my heart, washes my heart, changing my black heart into a white heart.” After ten days of such a revival, John Sung would leave and everything would leak away. Then Wang Ming-tao would come, and again the people, including the elderly and the young, would sing, “The precious blood of Jesus washes my heart, washes my heart, changing my black heart into a white heart.” After Wang Ming-tao left, two months later the spirit would dry up and leak away, and the number of people attending meetings would also drop. Consequently, elders and pastors would meet to discuss the situation and then send a cable to invite Brother So-and-so from Canton. Once again, everyone would gather together to pray, to thank the Lord, and to praise Him. The church has been living a life of constant dependence upon revival meetings for the past two hundred years. This is like being addicted to morphine injections. The number of people in the church has increased, but the stature of Christ in the church has not increased.
We must ask ourselves: What are we doing here in Taiwan? Are we doing a revival work? Or are we providing a way for Christ to increase His stature in the church? We should never despise the preaching of the gospel to lead men to salvation. However, we should bear in mind that we should not pay attention merely to the preaching of the gospel in order to bring people to salvation while neglecting their knowledge of Christ after their salvation. The preaching of the gospel is to find material; the bringing of people to the knowledge of Christ is to build up these materials. The extent to which the saints can be built up and edified in the church depends upon how much we know Christ inwardly. For this reason I am not surprised when people speak with me regarding the situation of the churches, because I expect this. If the saints do not have an adequate inward knowledge of Christ, what else can be done other than revival works? We need the Lord’s mercy that some among us will be enlightened by this word.
May God grant His church a spirit of revelation that the eyes of many of the saints will be opened. Our intention is neither to cause those who do not have a heart for the Lord to have a heart, nor to cause those who have a heart for the Lord to be more fervent. Rather, our desire is that some among us will be shown mercy and be enlightened. We should not pay attention to revival; we should change revival to revelation. We need revelation. The serving saints in all the localities need to see God’s plan and how Christ is life in them. We need to see that we are the problem and frustration to Christ. We need to prostrate ourselves, stop ourselves, fully yield ourselves to Christ, absolutely surrendering to Him and giving all our rights and ground to Him. No virtue can replace Christ, not even our zeal, patience, humility, or kindness; only Christ Himself is Christ. It is obvious that evil is not Christ, but neither is good Christ; only Christ Himself is Christ. Although we still live out goodness, the life that Christ lives out through us surpasses our goodness. We need to see this. This is what the Lord wants to do today. We should not despise the preaching of the gospel, but we need to pay attention to this revelation. I hope that we will all see this, pay attention to this, and spread what we have seen.
